Brakes, or whats left of them

[cullenwinter]

Thanks to everyone who helped make La Junta a great weekend. Instructors, cornerworkers, etc. everyone was awesome. Also thanks to Micah in the Mini for pushing me to my best laps ( 1:04s) of the weekend on the last session, what a blast !!
I came home with a warped rotor (RF) on my wagon, no big suprise, as hard as they've worked for 75K miles. I'm looking for input on the decision to spend $ on slotted ($90 and up) versus the OEM brembo discs ($45). I didn't experience any fade all weekend, and am not sure what would justify the additional cost of replacement. I definitely won't be upgrading to bigger brakes anytime soon. Please leave your opinions pro & con. Thanks, see you all in Pueblo

[Mikecolosprings]

I've seen many magazine tests on slotted rotors and they see a pretty tiny improvment. Mabye 1-2FT, now if you can get some bigger rotors that would help a little more
The slots help with pads though, they wear off all of the heat glazing from overheating.
I don't believe all that gas BS
You might want to run some small Brake ducting to the fronts.

[MHISSTC]

I cracked my left front rotor on Saturday. It was a Disc-Brakes-R-Us unit cast in Canada. That was a replacement to the original Kelsey Hays castings I finally cracked at the last Pueblo event.

Replacement Brembo rotors are in my future. I wish I could get mine for $45 each! For that price, I think I'd stick with the original Brembos. With the money saved, I'd either buy a backup set to bring to the track, and/or add some additional brake cooling ductwork.

Here are some other suggestions to eliminate/reduce rotor warp: LaJunta is a short track. Make that final lap a GOOD cooldown lap...drive it without touching the brakes at all, circle the paddock for some additional cooldown time, and after you park the car, make sure you don't use the E-brake and roll the car forward several inches every couple of minutes. The rotor/pad assembly retains heat in it, which will keep the portion of your rotor within the assembly hotter than the portion of the rotor outside of it, possibly inducing some warpage.

I neglected to incrementally roll my car forward on Saturday and think this is one contributor to my cracked rotor. Unlike my original KH rotors, there were no other smaller heat stress cracks present in the rotors before the giant fissure appeared.

[Evil86Saleen]

I had similar problems. If I where you I would stick with the original Brembos and take the money you saved for either upgraded pads or cooling ducts.

My problem is simply brakes that are to small for the car. Scott knows what I'm talking about and honestly I think they performed better than I had expected.

I will be stepping up to bigger stock 11inch rotors and ditching the stock 55mm calipers in favor of a set of 73s along with a master cyl that holds more fluid. This still may not be the best set up but it is the best of the factory parts that can be bolted on and still retain my stock Saleen 16 inch wheels.

I will also be upgrading the brake lines, caliper pins and making some cooling ducts.

kyle

[CMC#35]

Kyle,

I run 16x8 wheels on my car. The front rotors are 12", which are a "special" size for Mustang. This is driven by the CMC rules: the limit is 12" because that's the biggest rotor that came stock on the Camaros. There are two approaches to getting 12" rotors for Mustangs.
1) call Baer, and buy their special made 12" rotors.
2) be a whole lot more courageous than I am, and buy 13" rotors from an auto parts store, then have them turned down to 12". several CMC'ers swear by this; I wouldn't dream of doing it.

Then, with the 12" rotor, I run Cobra calipers. The mounting holes on the caliper brackets have to be re-drilled, so that the calipers will move "in" (toward the center of the rotor) and the pads will fit correctly over the rotor. Baer also sells these caliper brackets; they're not much more than a regular bracket.

I wasn't able to find these rotors and brackets on Baer's website, but if you call them, and tell them you're trying to set up a Fox Mustang for CMC, they'll probably know exactly what you mean.

http://www.baer.com/

If this has totally confused you, send me a note. Or, I can show you the rotors/brackets when we all get to Pueblo.

-chris

[Evil86Saleen]

Thanks for the info Chris. That will be real helpfull on the CMC car. Right now we have the SN95 front suspension on the car with the GT 11 inch rotors and the big PBRs. I will have to contact bear and see how much of that we can use or if I should just start over fresh with the parts that you are talking about.

Not to sound like to much of a Melvin but I wanted to keep as many of the stock Saleen parts on my Saleen mustang as possible. Thats why I was looking at running the bigger stock stuff.

However it looks like Bear has a 12 inch front upgrade for the 79 -86 cars that retains all of the stock early fox suspension components like the struts and the spindles. :D That is perfect for the Saleen and exactly what I'm looking for. Its a little pricey but hey you have to stop right.

kyle

[cullenwinter]

Thanks for the feedback, I was thinking about ducting, maybe taking out the fogs and using flexible dryer ducting hose or something like that. I would be grateful to hear input on that idea, any other suby folks try it ??

[leggwork]

dryer duct hose will disintegrate quickly in the wheel well (assuming it extends out close to the brakes). Use CEET-12 or similar (available at aircraft supply houses).
cheers,
bruce

Thanks for the feedback, I was thinking about ducting, maybe taking out the fogs and using flexible dryer ducting hose or something like that. I would be grateful to hear input on that idea, any other suby folks try it ??

[Warrtalon]

Cullen, thank your wife (I think) for helping me. Based on her synopsis, I am getting 2 new front rotors with all new pads (different brand) and fluid free of charge - they're already on the way.

I don't know if you noticed on the Evo, but I have brake duct cooling kits. From outside, you can only see the little inlets on my front mesh, although I'm sure the tubing was visible when the wheel was off, too.

Here's pic on track and then some pics from the install:

http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b336/warrtalon/PMI-NASA-2.jpg

http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b336/warrtalon/pass-duct--piping.jpg

http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b336/warrtalon/pass-duct--piping-close.jpg

[CMC#35]

The PBRs should be okay, but your approach is the right one - talk to Baer.:)

-chris

I will have to contact bear and see how much of that we can use or if I should just start over fresh with the parts that you are talking about.

[Ludachris]

Cullen, in my experience with aftermarket rotors, there really isn't a whole lot of difference between one brand and the next. They're all pretty close to the same product. The only time it changes is when you move up to a thicker rotor, which usually means a big brake kit.

If you're not ready for that, I'd just get some slotted rotors and try some ducting. That, along with the cool down tips suggested by Scott and you should be fine. As for the ducting, here's the place I'll likely go through for mine before the next track event:
http://www.pegasusautoracing.com/group.asp?GroupID=AIRHOSE

[Evil86Saleen]

Thanks for the link. Very helpfull.

Anyone know what size of hose would be dig enough for cooling front brakes?

kyle

[MHISSTC]

As big as you could get to fit would be my generic answer on brake ducting. I really like the look of the little welded up forge brand "nozzles" that Warrtalon has at the end of the ductwork that focuses a blast of air right at the rotor.

Warralton, where can a person pick up those forge items? Are they attached to the backing plate?

[Mustcone347]

However it looks like Bear has a 12 inch front upgrade for the 79 -86 cars that retains all of the stock early fox suspension components like the struts and the spindles. That is perfect for the Saleen and exactly what I'm looking for. Its a little pricey but hey you have to stop right.


I have a Bear front setup for PBR calipers(spindles/hubs/rotors)
make me an offer

malcolm

[Warrtalon]

As big as you could get to fit would be my generic answer on brake ducting. I really like the look of the little welded up forge brand "nozzles" that Warrtalon has at the end of the ductwork that focuses a blast of air right at the rotor.

Warralton, where can a person pick up those forge items? Are they attached to the backing plate?

http://www.ForgeMotorsport.com. They are one of my sponsors and just recently released this for the Evo. The ducts connect to my caliper bolts on the back side of the hub.

[cullenwinter]

Here's a link for the aircraft ducting that Bruce (I think) suggested, the CEET 12. http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/appages/ceet.php Looks like it fits my budget ! Nice ducting Warralton. Chris, do you think the slotted rotors are worth the double cost over the plain OEM brembos ? I'm running PBR ultimate pads, which held up way better than the last ceramic compound I tried.

[Evil86Saleen]

I have a Bear front setup for PBR calipers(spindles/hubs/rotors)
make me an offer

malcolm

PM sent.

kyle

[MHISSTC]

Forge's pictures and a description of the setup Warrtalon has are in this link:

http://www.forgemotorsport.com/content.asp?inc=product&cat=0802&product=FMEVOBCD

They call that sweet piece that bolts to the stock Brembo calipers a diffuser. :cool: Too bad they don't appear to make them for any other vehicles. I wonder what other cars are running those same or similar calipers that the diffusers can be adapted to?

Warrtalon, there looks to be plenty of room on your car for running the ductwork. Do you get any interference between the ductwork and the suspension components?

I see a new front brake setup in Kyle's future.

[MHISSTC]

After a bit of searching, the best price I found on front Brembo rotors for my car is at www.autobarn.com $125.90/pr +$7.95 shipping. Now I have to decide if I want to get rear rotors while I'm at it. Brembo rear rotors are $65.90/pr. Orders over $150 get free shipping. Break out the credit card!

[CMC#35]

Chris, do you think the slotted rotors are worth the double cost over the plain OEM brembos ? I'm running PBR ultimate pads, which held up way better than the last ceramic compound I tried.

I think there are two Chris' on this board, but just in case this question was for me...

I use plain ol' rotors on my CMC Mustang, and have never had a problem or concern. I've never used slotted rotors.

-chris